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Since I posted my last blog on Saturday I can see lots of people visited. Thank you, one and all who stopped by - would love to have some comments on what you thought.
Did you agree, disagree? I'm curious.
Please feel free to comment on anything that I have written. All thoughts are welcome
5 comments:
Hi John,
I saw your post asking if anyone had any questions or comments. I do happen to have one! :)
I know you have probably been asked this before, but I would like to humbly enquire how you reconcile the fact that you are a gay Christian man with 1 Corinthians 6:9?
"Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: neither the sexually immoral, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor men who practice homosexuality, nor thieves, nor the greedy, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God."
Or Romans 1:26-27, where the passage is talking about the people's sin?
"Because of this, God gave them over to shameful lusts. Even their women exchanged natural relations for unnatural ones. In the same way the men also abandoned natural relations with women and were inflamed with lust for one another."
Hello Anonymous,
Surprise! Surprise! I am very aware of all these few scriptures. I wrestled with them for most of my life, and I don't realise what it is like to live life thinking that God hates you even though you love Him.
However let me try and explain.
The scriptures you mention have a cultural context. The Greek word translated "homosexuality" is arsenokoite - does not mean that at all - it is referring to male prostitutes. However - I would also direct you to verse 10. And that is what some of you were. But you were washed, you were sanctified, you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and by the Spirit of our God." (NIV)
Romans 1 passage speaks about exchanging natural relation for unnatural ones. Well, in my whole life - I have NEVER naturally desired woman - it has been for me - from the beginning only a desire with other males. I would suggest that the second part was an example. God gave them over to shameful lusts - I do not believe it is a complete list - for instance it doesn't mention a father lusting for his own daughter or a man lusting after his own mother. These surely are shameful lusts that Paul would mention if he were making a complete list. He doesn't. I do not think that two people who are drawn to one another in a committed relationship is shameful, regardless of their gender. Sadly there are a lot of misconceptions of what it is to be a homosexual.
It is shameful, in my understanding for a man, knowing he does not love a woman, to marry her, to hide his homosexuality, to conform with certain social norms. That is not only hypocritical - it is damaging - and Jesus spoke a lot about hypocrisy. Strange thing is Jesus actually had nothing to say about homosexuality. He did say that at the end two will be in one bed, and one will be taken and the other will be left behind. In the KJV it actually says two men - but apparently "men" was an insertion of the translaters - the original Greek would be literally translated:
And two will be in ONE bed - One will be taken, the other will be left. (Luke 17:34) The ONE and the OTHER - pronouns - are masculine in the Greek.
Thank you for asking anonymous. I know a lot of people get hung up on those verses.
Anonymous friend - I do not suppose my answer will satisfy you. It is not easy to give a succinct answer to these questions, but rest assured that I have known what it is to trust Jesus as my Lord and Saviour. I believe, that when I gave my life to the Lord, it was a sincere and real commitment. I know that whether or not "homosexuality" is a sin, when Jesus died on the cross, he PAID for it all. I am no longer under condemnation, and NOTHING can separate me from the Love of God that is in Christ Jesus our Lord.
I know that the Holy Spirit (God) is He who was sent into the world to convict man of sin. He has not convicted me of that sin.
Thank you for asking, and bless you.
Hi John!
Thank you for your answer. While I think I see where you are coming from, I'm afraid I still unfortunately disagree. :) It looks like we will have to agree to disagree here, but I can present a few final points nonetheless.
Firstly, I disagree that homosexuality is not a sin. However you interpret 1 Cor 6:9, how would you explain Leviticus 18:22: "Do not lie with a man as one lies with a woman; that is detestable." ?
With regard to 1 Cor 6:10, I think it is quite self explanatory, and to interpret it in any other way would be inaccurate. The verse says "that is what you WERE...", not " this is what you are now". When we are "washed" and "sanctified", we must put off these things.
I accept that some people may be born more inclined one way or the other, but this does not make homosexuality right; in the same way that a violent person is not excused for murdering someone because he was born violent. Even I struggle with many sins, some much more than others! But I recognize them as sin, and try to avoid them.
I do believe it possible to be a homosexual Christian, but not one that believes it is not a sin. This is based on 1 Cor 6:9, where the verse is talking about people who are living in the sins specified there, with the strict warning that those who persevere in these sins will not inherit the kingdom of God.
We all struggle with sin however, and no sin is greater than any other. God does promise that he will renew us if we allow him, which I am sure you are aware of:
2 Corinthians 5:17: "Therefore, if anyone is in Christ, he is a new creation; the old has gone, the new has come!"
I hope I haven't been too confrontational in my approach, I wish you no insult or upset! :) As a fellow believer, I just feel it necessary to bring the truth in love.
I hope you have a blessed Christmas John! :) Thank you for our conversation.
Best wishes.
Dear Anonymous,
Thank you for having your little preach on my blog. Unfortunately since you do not leave a return address, I cannot return the favour.
It is Christmas Eve, actually soon it will be Christmas Day. I am not going to give a complete rebuttal right now - as you say, we'll have to agree to disagree.
At some stage, I will take up this discussion, just not today.
I have some questions of my own, so watch this space.
Well, assuming there are others actually following this "conversation", I'm just letting you all know that Anonymous wrote to me and apologised for being "incognito" - but as it turns out, I know and have met him.
Since he did include personally identifying data such as his email address, I decided not to post the comment, but suffice it to say I am satisfied that he is in earnest.
I will not remove his comments or his views as I believe in balance and free speech, even where I do not personally agree with what he is saying.
His views, of course are not his views alone, but are those regarded as orthodox by most evangelical Christian believers the world over. They are views that I subscribed to for most of my life.
His views however still are a view, and in not anyway the only possible interpretation of what the Scriptures are saying on this matter.
I shall in due course put forward a different view, and those who are interested are invitedto:
a) come back and read what I have to say, and
b) join the conversation.
My anonymous friend is still welcome to present his perspective. I will say to anyone who wants to post anonymously to feel free and do so - though it would be good if you could make up nom de plume so we can establish who is who. If you choose to make your identity known to me, I would appreciate that - simply post another comment pointing who you are and I will keep that off my blog.
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